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About jonbirch

animator, illustrator, character designer, graphic designer. music producer/recording musician. co-owner of PROOST. proost.co.uk
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32 Responses to 424

  1. I used never curse even while playing matches but recently it’s been infilitrating to my chagrin. Trying to eliminate it although the Apostle Paul may even have used it in his letters :-)

  2. Mark says:

    Being violent and abusive in church football has a long and glorious history. After all, even Paul and Barnabas were sent off.

  3. Rachel says:

    Why is it that people say this? Yes as a Christian I believe we shouldnt swear but none of us are perfect. My mums favourite phrase is , “I thought you were a Christian”… sometimes I wonder what that statement can do to peoples faith – I know what its done to mine in the past.

  4. marcus says:

    this cartoon has missed the *!*!!* point ;-)

  5. Carole says:

    Footy didn’t go too well last night then, Jon?

    Good analogy. If you were an advocate of neurolinguistic programming, you would have visualised the positive outcome of this scenario, and at least you wouldn’t have hoofed it over the bar, even if it had been saved. Perhaps, as Christians, we don’t do enough visualising of positive outcomes. Perhaps our faith is weak. Personally I prefer to think of it as taking the scenic route to perfection. :)

  6. jonbirch says:

    ‘Personally I prefer to think of it as taking the scenic route to perfection.’ hahahahaha! what a cracking line! :-)

    didn’t play last night carole… spent all day on the toilet… that was enough exercise for one day. :-)

    mark… you’re right… and the cross was always central to their game too. sorry. :-)

    yes rachel… ‘i thought you were a christian’ is a very annoying line indeed. i genuinely don’t see myself as any better than anyone else… in fact the opposite often… i would rather have a friend who was really honest and swore, than a friend who didn’t see their own failings but whose manners were impeccable.

    where do we get this idea that we shouldn’t swear from? can swearing sometimes be ‘good’ language not ‘bad’ language? can nice language sometimes be more damaging, especially if it conceals the reality? … and lastly, isn’t swearing sometimes just really funny? or have i overstepped the mark? and if i have overstepped the mark, whose mark have i overstepped? God’s, yours, the church’s?

    marcus… you shock me… and i thought you were a christian! :-)

    red wine gums… nothing worse than curses infiltrating your chagrin! :-)

  7. @jon
    Let me tell you it’s a 100 times worse when it’s the samurai goldfish doing the infilitrating. Seriously. Does anyone think rubbish is the word intended in Phillipians 3:8 when Paul says I count all things as…?

  8. Carole says:

    Hope you’re feeling better today, Jon.

  9. becky says:

    Jon – I too have a bit of a potty mouth. I’ve realized I’m human so I focus my efforts at trying not to direct my swear words at anyone in an attempt to harm them.

  10. Barry says:

    What is “bad” language anyway? My thoughts on the matter are here: http://tinyurl.com/2c4fhd

    I don’t recall it saying of Christ-followers anywhere in the Bible: “By their vocabulary you shall know them.”

  11. shelly says:

    Coincidentally, the Greek word for the verb “sin” means “to miss the mark”.

    I digress a little.

    I like Carole’s comment: “Personally I prefer to think of it as taking the scenic route to perfection. :)” I also agree with Barry’s blog post on the matter. Sometimes those words are the only words that suit a certain occasion, IMO.

  12. ben says:

    do u think its good to get angry in sport though? i used to play tennis like 7 days a week back in the day, and i ended up giving it up for 2 years or whatever, because it was a major part of my life where i would get really angry. dunno what you think of this, but anger in sport comes from pride right? and if you never swear in everyday life but mouth off all the time in a game when u are angry, that is not a good witness to anybody.

  13. ben says:

    i dunno, for me i only swear when im angry, so im guessing i put intent behind my words, while someone else will use swear words in casual conversation and they dont mean anything by it.

  14. jonbirch says:

    interesting conversation. i have only once got properly angry at someone on the football pitch and that was because of my own stuff inside which had been simmering away. i apologised immediately and felt very bad about it. i think that’s different from using fruity language when you miss a goal.

    good post barry. very thought provoking. i broadly agree with you.

    i’m sometimes a bit disturbed by the educated looking down on the less educated (although i don’t fully agree with that division) who do swear every other word. could it not be it’s just another way of practising snobbery? you could be a fully signed up, card carrying swearer and be the most generous person with your time ever… yet many would not see you for who you are because of there own prejudice about the language you use. now if you’re going out of your way to needlessly be offensive that’s one thing, but many who swear all the time aren’t like that.

    the problem with using terms like ‘you brood of vipers’ or whatever the modern equivalent might be is you’d better be pretty sure you’re not one yourself.

    re rwg no.7. does anyone know what an accurate translation of pauls words that we translate to be ‘rubbish’ actually is?

    shelly. i agree with you. but then i deliberately don’t swear in my cartoons when a simple horrible word might better sum up how i feel on a subject. i guess here i’d rather invite conversation than simply mouth off… although i do enjoy mouthing off a bit. :-)

    carole… a fair bit better thanks carole. :-)

    i think that’s a good discipline becky. i like the phrase ‘potty mouth’. i remember my grandma washing my mouth out with soap once… lifebouy carbolic soap… eeeeuuuch! :-)

    ben… people who mouth off in a game are very annoying. thankfully with the group i play with nobody does it and i think we are self sensoring for the most part… not a christian bunch or anything, just a right good bunch of people in my view. love ‘em. there is a proper degree of tolerance for each others shortcomings for the most part as well. it is okay i think to show the odd bit of anger or frustration, but most likely you will hear encouragement, funny ribbing, or bad jokes. :-)

  15. @jon
    I hate doing this (linking to your own blog in a high traffic site) but I dealt with it on my own blog if you’re interested. The translation is in the polite sense dung ;-) If you want more in depth stuff on the issue check out this post by Joe Carter and some of the people he links to.

  16. jonbirch says:

    good post rwg :-) … and an interesting quote from mark twain as well… his quote raises an interesting question about language in prayer, very thought provoking… does god want us to be polite with him/her, or honest? how do we express ourselves in communication with god. whatever we express in life is expressed before god anyhow… if we believe in god then we believe that all we are, say and do is witnessed by god… hmmmm… you got me thinking…

  17. @jon #16
    Well God knows our thoughts so refusing to verbalise our feelings in His eyes probably doesn’t accomplish much. I think it’s about walking the line between the fact He is our friend but also God i.e. sovereign Lord of all, omnipotent etc.

  18. Robb says:

    Interesting –

    Can we all go and get our bibles out please. KJV please.

    Our texts for today will be 2Kings 18:27 and Isaiah 36:12

    Language (well the English language) is a constantly evolving phenomenon. When is a word reclassified? Was it when the Sex Pistols used it? When did God stop liking the word? Was that when the sex pistols started using it?

    When I walk into a working mens club I am bombarded with pit talk. It don’t really give a…

    Ironic. You can either go down in the estimations of those inside church or outside it. You just have to pick which one you want. People change to the situation around them. If I am sat at home working I am wearing jeans and a t-shirt. If I am going for a job interview I am wearing a suit anf tie. For what you have to say to be heard sometimes it needs to have the right appearance:

    70% How you look
    20% How you sound
    10% What you say

    Unfortunatly it tends to come in that order.

    In Yak Yak Yak by Mike Yakonelli he talks about a wonderful oportunity for evangelism missed because they kicked the girl who wanted to follow christ out because she…. lets try to get my words right…. ‘cussed’.

  19. Carole says:

    I don’t especially like ‘fruity language’ but I see it as having a key role in life. These are the words we hold in reserve for stress points in life. Once they fall into common everyday usage, the only place to go is GBH. When I stub my toe or get a sudden shock, I spout off a ‘litany’ of expletives. I like to keep ‘swear words’ for just such occasions. I travel by bus a lot and hear a lot of unnecessary swearing from sweet young things. I don’t know whether it is the words that bother me most or the poor use of them. They go, “..blah blah blah, f**kin’ blah blah blah, f**kin’ blah blah blah, f**kin’ blah…” ad nauseam. It’s a waste of an expletive. I also hate listening to RP swearers – not because I expect better, but because they just can’t do it. I cite Hugh Grant in 4 weddings etc. to support this argument. And if I hear one more boring rapper rattle off ‘motherf**kin’ in that stylised way, I’ll scream. It may be a deeply offensive concept but overuse has reduced it to a mere cliché. I come from the place where we swear most effectively, the only place, in my humble opinion, where Anglo-Saxon expletives are given their full guttural weight (dubious claim to fame :lol: ). Although when witnessing the experts at full throttle, it’s well scary!). 8O

    Back on topic: we need to sort out the difference between sin and social offence.

  20. Robb says:

    So you’re Scottish then ;)

  21. Robb says:

    So you’re Scotish then ;)

  22. Robb says:

    How did it do that? How did it change the speelong?

  23. Carole says:

    Eh sunshine, you know I’m neither Scottish nor Scotish. You’re getting the look of death, now…can you feel it? ;)

  24. Carole says:

    Speelong? Isn’t that just outside Melbourne?

  25. Robb says:

    I can feel the stare. I do not want to sell you death sticks. I want to go home and rethink my life.

    the place where we swear most effectively, the only place, in my humble opinion, where Anglo-Saxon expletives are given their full guttural weight

    Like I said yesterday – my family are all Scottish and they all fit that description. Tha dunt talk like that round er thanose

  26. arjwdotcom says:

    When I saw this one, I had instantly remembered the story on ESPN from the day before of Dwight Howard (Center, Orland Magic, NBA) and a pending paternity suit that has been filed against him.

    He came out of high school to the NBA and this year has really stepped up his game. Also, he’s a believer. One of the first things he stated was that he wanted to let Christ be his light as he plays.

    Then the story of a child he has, and this. I’d imagine that there are a lot of people on the side looking at him saying “I thought he was a Christian.”

    Wonder if he feels the stares, or worse?

  27. jonbirch says:

    ‘the difference between sin and social offence.’ good point carole.

  28. Andy in Germany says:

    Is he swearing because he missed, or is he swearing at the goalie for moving the goalpost to 3′ high?

  29. jonbirch says:

    it’s a five-a-side goal… and he’s swearing because someone put spoons on his boots. :-)

  30. Mike Jones says:

    I’m part of a “God Squad” (accountability group + football team in one) and one of the things we focus on is what part of our emotions and personalities get “exposed” when we play sport. We try to focus on increasing the positive ones (encouragement, hard work, team playing, etc.) and decreasing the negative (anger, swearing, selfishness, etc.).

    All sport exposes who you really are, it’s what you do about it that matters. Sanctification is a process not an event and football is great for showing you how far you’ve yet to progress!

  31. inge says:

    i thought he was supposed to be the king of israel?

  32. FSWood says:

    Somewhere along the way when life was being frustrating and deeply disappointing for a number of years I made a conscious decision to Start swearing the “reasoning” being, hey, Not swearing doesn’t seem to have helped make my life one of the better types, so what difference does it make if I do or do not? Might as well go on with it.
    And then a few years later, “See, life is no different than when I did not.”
    Well, now I want to stop and am having quite a time doing so – why isn’t my decision to stop resulting in my stopping-period, finis?

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