A good representation of affluent western Christians. We consume a lot of resources at the expense of the world’s poor. But I worry that the message people will see here is “fat people are ____” (hypocrites, gluttons, etc).
dear bugaboo, I’m a Christian and I’m fat, I love my food, I acknowledge it’s a weakness, and I ask for God’s help regularly to overcome this, I also have an underactive thyroid which doesn’t help. Fortunatly my fellow Christians love me despite my faults, and with their love support and prayers I try each day to live my life the way God want’s me to. But like you and every one else I’m not perfect and will slip up. But God’s love it never ending and he will not give up on me just because I’m fat.
Unfortunately in this country it is far more expensive to be healthy than the alternative. I help out with youthwork at my church which is in an urban deprived area. Poverty in this country is often families in council houses for whom 3 for a pound ready meals are a way of feeding their families…
I guess I already said what I think about giving in the other thread [resistance is fertile] where I was already going off on one about the church meeting last night and taking rather than giving….
Coral frog, you are so right. I used to be BIG. As soon as I went on a diet and lost 7 st I realised I could be poor and healthy or rich and dead.
The problem is that people in urban deprived areas can’t afoard to feed their kids with anything other than Netto chips fishfingers and beans (50p) because real ingredients cost so much!
Does anyone remember Jamie and Oliver from Harry Enfields last show?
As a total asside, his best character ever was the chemist!! [and part 2]Very rude but very funny!!
I look in here every day and steal the toons for our website because I’m often accused of being too ‘brutal’ in my writing and they say what I want to say….thanks Jon, you’re a gem!
btw..I’m overweight and couldn’t be happier…thankfully God doesn’t take much notice of what it looks like on the outside.
But this toon does bring to mind my recent beef about a local church (dead? I didn’t say it was dead…lol) who are trying to raise 4 million for the fabric of a building that about 20 people worship in. Fat church, well scoured on the outside…grrrrrr
Judging people on their appearance is ingrained into us, deeper than conditioning could achieve, I think. It’s a sort of memetic response. The challenge is to try to see everyone as an individual, without pre-judging based on appearance. Meanwhile, all our brains are trying to do is to compartmentalise and pigeonhole the things we see, in order to make sense of the world. So it’s a losing battle, but one worth fighting I think.
Overweight is a very visible thing. If self-righteousness were as visible, I guess some of us would look awful. Logs in eyes and all that.
Having been nearly 20st and nearly 10 st in the last 5 years I can confirm that people treat you completely differently. People would hear exactly the same words coming out of my mouth but their reactions were different.
Metaphorically, this is a great cartoon that is absolutely spot on. We are fat with resources and do very little for the poor in a lot of ways. Some churches / Christ followers do much, but for the most part i think we horde Christianity and “blessings” for ourselves. Our demographic is the middle and upper class, helping the poor only when its absolutely necessary and does not infringe on our way of comfort and enjoyment…
But i echo much of the sentiment, expressed originally in comment #2. If you look at this from a church / body of Christ / resource availability point of view, good stuff … if you look at this literally, too much stereotyping.
botticelliwoman… i’m picturing you barely clad arising from a conch shell with gold hair down to your knees. all i have is a name as reference for you and first impressions make an impact. even a name. if you called yourself fotherington smythe, i’d assume you were rich, although that may be completely wrong. and ‘thanks’ btw.
jf is right… and it is worth the struggle.
that is fascinating robb. proving jf’s point.
anyway re. the cartoon. it’s not really anything to do with individual obesity in a way. as jf said above it is a way of saying we have everything while they have nothing. that is the point i am making.
will… you’re ‘big boned’!
i’ll take the flack if need be for the allegory i’ve chosen. jesus spoke of camels, the eye of a needle and rich people in much the same way.
some of my best friends are overweight… i myself have a stone and a half to lose… so i’m not pointing fingers in that way… i promise.
helen… indeed god will not. thanks for your comment. you’re no more guilty than the rest of us and much more honest than most.
carole… nice gag… but if that is weightwatchers they aren’t really putting the effort in!
i remember a story jonny baker told me of going to a christians against poverty type bash… there was a lunchtime buffet… but by the time the last people in the queue got to the food it had pretty much all gone, just a few crisps and crumbs were all that was left. the irony did not escape him.
the kingdom of heaven model turns that greed and thoughtlessness on its head and that’s what i like about it. ‘the last shall be the first…’
Bless me Father, for I have sinned…it’s been several cartoons since my last confession. I remember going to a wedding once which joined two Christian ‘friends’ in holy matrimony. The invite was accompanied by a slip of paper which contained my instructions for what to provide for the ‘bring and share’ wedding breakfast. I had not long committed to my faith so was still trying to fob off worldly ideas. My public response was one of “what a good idea”, privately it was, “pair of tight a*ses, you’d think they’d have paid for their own food.” On the day, I dutifully turned up in my best bib and tucker, carefully avoiding any grease from the ‘16 chicken drumsticks’ that I had been instructed to carry to the church hall (16? seeing a plate of chicken drumsticks sickens me – all those chickens losing their lives so we can have finger nibbles! Obscene!). The mountain of food, and I mean mountain, that was thrown out was shameful – far more than you would normally have if you provided the buffet yourself. I suppose I shouldn’t have scoffed (no pun intended) at the bring and share, it is, no doubt, the thing to do in such circumstances. My response was to eat far more than I would normally to avoid waste – for some reason it feels like less of a waste if it passes through my digestive tract first, before being disposed of. I am about 3 stone overweight as the result of such bouts of gluttony.
The link below shows a drawing that a friend of mine did – she is a teacher of art in a local comp and is a gorgeous and very gifted woman. These are some of her works which she entered in our church art exhibition. She did the charcoal nude when she took her GCSE student to a life class. She loved drawing this lady because, although she was curvaceous, she had very delicate and elegant gestures…so I’m told. I don’t know what the Year 11s made of her! I can always rely on my mate to exhibit works which are a bit more daring and diverse. This got some funny comments, given it was exhibited in the church and displayed among the pretty watercolours of ‘Hilltop Farm’ and the like.
Great stuff Carole. Your friend is doing some great drawings. It’s vital to take risks isn’t it? I loved this one Jon. Some of your stuff is like a visual parable.
Most of the more well-off people I know are quite skinny and are occasionally beautiful by their own standards. They buy M&S food all the time, eat in restaurants a lot, buy expensive clothes, drive flashy gas guzzling cars, have at least three colours on their hair, have had ‘enhancement’ procedures of some sort, have several foreign holidays per year (often long haul), are members of decent gyms and use them and have artificial fingernails (and that’s just the men!). No that that makes them bad people, you understand, just high maintenance.
Maybe if the cartoon showed all the SUVs and shiny cars they drove (separately, no doubt) to the convention in the parking lot it would make the point more about waste and consumption and less about food in particular. But a good cartoon in any event, as always.
Reading some of the comments I found myself thinking theres a bit of a tension to try and find, and as with many of the ‘balances’ in Christianity its not easy to find!
You see I don’t think we are called to do everything on a shoe string budget and as cheaply as we can, and I don’t think its wrong to enjoy life and some of the material blessings in it.
But of course the question is, when is it too much.
Obviously if its totally selfish and theres no attempt whatsoever to serve and bless others, or only a token attempt to alleviate conscience then thats wrong and sinfully, but what about the rest in between?
I am fat, but it’s my thyroid. LOL! This cartoon offended at first, but then when I came back to it, I realized how true it is. Not to get to serious, BUT what my family throws away could feed many I’m sure. We are all guilty of having a little to much of something, but I think it’s a heart thing. I could be skinny and still stingy with my giving to the poor. OK, now could someone help me down off my soapbox?
Comment by thevikingfru — April 10, 2008 @ 12:27 am
that’s funny carole. i’ve just done a logo for a project rocky’s doing. it’s a croc eating chocolate! i hope the confession has scoured your soul! the pic of the woman in the field with the summer dress is particularly nice.
glad you revisited the cartoon vikingfru… ‘it’s a heart thing. I could be skinny and still stingy with my giving to the poor.’ absolutely!
dr.nick… ‘tension’ is the word. i guess the first thing is to at least be aware of the tension.
thanks rocky!
cheers ron!
gene… you’re right, there are plenty more ways to talk of greed versus poverty. i’ve done one or two in the past i think. i’m sure i’ll be doing more.
Being a techie, I think about the wastefulness of a lot of things. Multiple computers in a house (all used only for email, browsing, and a lil music, but none at the same time); cable + wifi + cell + landline + walkie-talkie feature but only spend 100 minutes a month talking to people outside…
There’s a lot of things that in our “blessing” that we are really wasteful stewards in.
Wonder when the next “Waste Not Church Conference” will be to talk about this issue too.
Jon, the girl in the dress is one of her two beautiful (twin) daughters. She also has a great hubby and a lovely son who would make fab son-in-law material if only I could arrange it!
But you can’t have a convention tonight – the hall is booked for Weightwatchers!
Comment by Carole — April 9, 2008 @ 12:18 am
Don’t you just hate fat people?
Comment by Bugaboo — April 9, 2008 @ 2:35 am
A good representation of affluent western Christians. We consume a lot of resources at the expense of the world’s poor. But I worry that the message people will see here is “fat people are ____” (hypocrites, gluttons, etc).
Comment by Christine — April 9, 2008 @ 3:41 am
guilty… again [/dammit]
Comment by dorsey — April 9, 2008 @ 3:43 am
I love the metaphor – reminds me of limousine liberals – well intentioned people who show up to feed the poor wearing designer duds.
Comment by becky — April 9, 2008 @ 5:25 am
[...] 435 « The Ongoing Adventures of ASBO Jesus [...]
Pingback by Aufschreie, die Zweite « Kreuz & Quer — April 9, 2008 @ 6:16 am
Now that is QUALITY!
Comment by dennis coburn — April 9, 2008 @ 7:10 am
(5) I still call them Designer Christians.
Jon message for you on the previous post.
Comment by slowburn — April 9, 2008 @ 7:31 am
(5) I still call them Designer Christians.
Jon message for you on yesterdays posting.
Comment by slowburn — April 9, 2008 @ 7:32 am
bugaboo no.2… no i don’t.
Comment by jonbirch — April 9, 2008 @ 7:49 am
dear bugaboo, I’m a Christian and I’m fat, I love my food, I acknowledge it’s a weakness, and I ask for God’s help regularly to overcome this, I also have an underactive thyroid which doesn’t help. Fortunatly my fellow Christians love me despite my faults, and with their love support and prayers I try each day to live my life the way God want’s me to. But like you and every one else I’m not perfect and will slip up. But God’s love it never ending and he will not give up on me just because I’m fat.
Comment by helen — April 9, 2008 @ 7:56 am
i hope you don’t!
Comment by Will — April 9, 2008 @ 7:57 am
Unfortunately in this country it is far more expensive to be healthy than the alternative. I help out with youthwork at my church which is in an urban deprived area. Poverty in this country is often families in council houses for whom 3 for a pound ready meals are a way of feeding their families…
Comment by coralfrog — April 9, 2008 @ 8:55 am
I guess I already said what I think about giving in the other thread [resistance is fertile] where I was already going off on one about the church meeting last night and taking rather than giving….
Coral frog, you are so right. I used to be BIG. As soon as I went on a diet and lost 7 st I realised I could be poor and healthy or rich and dead.
The problem is that people in urban deprived areas can’t afoard to feed their kids with anything other than Netto chips fishfingers and beans (50p) because real ingredients cost so much!
Does anyone remember Jamie and Oliver from Harry Enfields last show?
As a total asside, his best character ever was the chemist!! [and part 2]Very rude but very funny!!
Comment by Robb — April 9, 2008 @ 10:11 am
I look in here every day and steal the toons for our website because I’m often accused of being too ‘brutal’ in my writing and they say what I want to say….thanks Jon, you’re a gem!
btw..I’m overweight and couldn’t be happier…thankfully God doesn’t take much notice of what it looks like on the outside.
But this toon does bring to mind my recent beef about a local church (dead? I didn’t say it was dead…lol) who are trying to raise 4 million for the fabric of a building that about 20 people worship in. Fat church, well scoured on the outside…grrrrrr
Comment by botticelliwoman — April 9, 2008 @ 1:09 pm
Judging people on their appearance is ingrained into us, deeper than conditioning could achieve, I think. It’s a sort of memetic response. The challenge is to try to see everyone as an individual, without pre-judging based on appearance. Meanwhile, all our brains are trying to do is to compartmentalise and pigeonhole the things we see, in order to make sense of the world. So it’s a losing battle, but one worth fighting I think.
Overweight is a very visible thing. If self-righteousness were as visible, I guess some of us would look awful. Logs in eyes and all that.
Comment by JF — April 9, 2008 @ 2:03 pm
Having been nearly 20st and nearly 10 st in the last 5 years I can confirm that people treat you completely differently. People would hear exactly the same words coming out of my mouth but their reactions were different.
Comment by Robb — April 9, 2008 @ 2:08 pm
JF #16,
“If self-righteousness were as visible, I guess some of us would look awful. Logs in eyes and all that.”
You’re so right. I shudder to think what some of us might look like. I hope I would look better now than I used to. I hope!
Comment by Lori — April 9, 2008 @ 2:12 pm
Metaphorically, this is a great cartoon that is absolutely spot on. We are fat with resources and do very little for the poor in a lot of ways. Some churches / Christ followers do much, but for the most part i think we horde Christianity and “blessings” for ourselves. Our demographic is the middle and upper class, helping the poor only when its absolutely necessary and does not infringe on our way of comfort and enjoyment…
But i echo much of the sentiment, expressed originally in comment #2. If you look at this from a church / body of Christ / resource availability point of view, good stuff … if you look at this literally, too much stereotyping.
Comment by jaybrams — April 9, 2008 @ 2:27 pm
botticelliwoman… i’m picturing you barely clad arising from a conch shell with gold hair down to your knees. all i have is a name as reference for you and first impressions make an impact. even a name. if you called yourself fotherington smythe, i’d assume you were rich, although that may be completely wrong.
and ‘thanks’ btw.
jf is right… and it is worth the struggle.
that is fascinating robb. proving jf’s point.
anyway re. the cartoon. it’s not really anything to do with individual obesity in a way. as jf said above it is a way of saying we have everything while they have nothing. that is the point i am making.
will… you’re ‘big boned’!
i’ll take the flack if need be for the allegory i’ve chosen. jesus spoke of camels, the eye of a needle and rich people in much the same way.
some of my best friends are overweight… i myself have a stone and a half to lose… so i’m not pointing fingers in that way… i promise.
Comment by jonbirch — April 9, 2008 @ 3:33 pm
denns, christine, thanks.
coral frog. i hear you.
helen… indeed god will not. thanks for your comment. you’re no more guilty than the rest of us and much more honest than most.
carole… nice gag… but if that is weightwatchers they aren’t really putting the effort in!
i remember a story jonny baker told me of going to a christians against poverty type bash… there was a lunchtime buffet… but by the time the last people in the queue got to the food it had pretty much all gone, just a few crisps and crumbs were all that was left. the irony did not escape him.
the kingdom of heaven model turns that greed and thoughtlessness on its head and that’s what i like about it. ‘the last shall be the first…’
Comment by jonbirch — April 9, 2008 @ 3:47 pm
go to this link if you’re interested in what others are saying on this cartoon. cool.
http://lordibelievehelpmyunbelief.blogspot.com/2008/04/well-this-is-motivation.html
Comment by jonbirch — April 9, 2008 @ 3:54 pm
But if it is cheaper to eat crap, surely we should all eat chicken nuggets and chips and give the surplus to the poor…
Comment by Robb — April 9, 2008 @ 4:01 pm
I’m QUITE happy to leave you with your initial impression…LOL
Comment by botticelliwoman — April 9, 2008 @ 4:21 pm
But we still need to keep ourselves healthy Robb!
Comment by Hayley — April 9, 2008 @ 4:27 pm
lol!
Against poverty.
Since the poor knew they wouldn’t be wanted, they didn’t show up!
Awesome!
Comment by ron — April 9, 2008 @ 4:31 pm
Or did they?
Comment by ron — April 9, 2008 @ 4:31 pm
Bugaboo! You don’t love me, then?
Comment by Carole — April 9, 2008 @ 5:17 pm
Bless me Father, for I have sinned…it’s been several cartoons since my last confession. I remember going to a wedding once which joined two Christian ‘friends’ in holy matrimony. The invite was accompanied by a slip of paper which contained my instructions for what to provide for the ‘bring and share’ wedding breakfast. I had not long committed to my faith so was still trying to fob off worldly ideas. My public response was one of “what a good idea”, privately it was, “pair of tight a*ses, you’d think they’d have paid for their own food.” On the day, I dutifully turned up in my best bib and tucker, carefully avoiding any grease from the ‘16 chicken drumsticks’ that I had been instructed to carry to the church hall (16? seeing a plate of chicken drumsticks sickens me – all those chickens losing their lives so we can have finger nibbles! Obscene!). The mountain of food, and I mean mountain, that was thrown out was shameful – far more than you would normally have if you provided the buffet yourself. I suppose I shouldn’t have scoffed (no pun intended) at the bring and share, it is, no doubt, the thing to do in such circumstances. My response was to eat far more than I would normally to avoid waste – for some reason it feels like less of a waste if it passes through my digestive tract first, before being disposed of. I am about 3 stone overweight as the result of such bouts of gluttony.
The link below shows a drawing that a friend of mine did – she is a teacher of art in a local comp and is a gorgeous and very gifted woman. These are some of her works which she entered in our church art exhibition. She did the charcoal nude when she took her GCSE student to a life class. She loved drawing this lady because, although she was curvaceous, she had very delicate and elegant gestures…so I’m told. I don’t know what the Year 11s made of her! I can always rely on my mate to exhibit works which are a bit more daring and diverse. This got some funny comments, given it was exhibited in the church and displayed among the pretty watercolours of ‘Hilltop Farm’ and the like.
http://www.holyfamilypensby.com/Features/creation2006/Gallery/pages/DSCN1217_JPG.htm
Comment by Carole — April 9, 2008 @ 6:05 pm
Great stuff Carole. Your friend is doing some great drawings. It’s vital to take risks isn’t it? I loved this one Jon. Some of your stuff is like a visual parable.
rocky
Comment by Mark Roques — April 9, 2008 @ 6:34 pm
Most of the more well-off people I know are quite skinny and are occasionally beautiful by their own standards. They buy M&S food all the time, eat in restaurants a lot, buy expensive clothes, drive flashy gas guzzling cars, have at least three colours on their hair, have had ‘enhancement’ procedures of some sort, have several foreign holidays per year (often long haul), are members of decent gyms and use them and have artificial fingernails (and that’s just the men!). No that that makes them bad people, you understand, just high maintenance.
Comment by Carole — April 9, 2008 @ 6:38 pm
Maybe if the cartoon showed all the SUVs and shiny cars they drove (separately, no doubt) to the convention in the parking lot it would make the point more about waste and consumption and less about food in particular. But a good cartoon in any event, as always.
Comment by Gene — April 9, 2008 @ 6:44 pm
Rocky, I’ve acquired a crocodile hand puppet to use as a prop in school and I’ve named him Rocky after you…just thought you’d like to know
Robb, perhaps you should get one for your work? You could get a pope-et and call it Benedict? Just like South Park, eh?
Comment by Carole — April 9, 2008 @ 8:09 pm
Reading some of the comments I found myself thinking theres a bit of a tension to try and find, and as with many of the ‘balances’ in Christianity its not easy to find!
You see I don’t think we are called to do everything on a shoe string budget and as cheaply as we can, and I don’t think its wrong to enjoy life and some of the material blessings in it.
But of course the question is, when is it too much.
Obviously if its totally selfish and theres no attempt whatsoever to serve and bless others, or only a token attempt to alleviate conscience then thats wrong and sinfully, but what about the rest in between?
Comment by DrNick — April 9, 2008 @ 9:32 pm
I am fat, but it’s my thyroid. LOL! This cartoon offended at first, but then when I came back to it, I realized how true it is. Not to get to serious, BUT what my family throws away could feed many I’m sure. We are all guilty of having a little to much of something, but I think it’s a heart thing. I could be skinny and still stingy with my giving to the poor. OK, now could someone help me down off my soapbox?
Comment by thevikingfru — April 10, 2008 @ 12:27 am
that’s funny carole. i’ve just done a logo for a project rocky’s doing. it’s a croc eating chocolate!
i hope the confession has scoured your soul! the pic of the woman in the field with the summer dress is particularly nice. 
glad you revisited the cartoon vikingfru… ‘it’s a heart thing. I could be skinny and still stingy with my giving to the poor.’ absolutely!
dr.nick… ‘tension’ is the word. i guess the first thing is to at least be aware of the tension.
thanks rocky!
cheers ron!
gene… you’re right, there are plenty more ways to talk of greed versus poverty. i’ve done one or two in the past i think. i’m sure i’ll be doing more.
Comment by jonbirch — April 10, 2008 @ 1:13 am
Truth be told:
I’m a skinny glutton. I’m really working on that this year, though.
Comment by Lori — April 10, 2008 @ 1:21 am
Being a techie, I think about the wastefulness of a lot of things. Multiple computers in a house (all used only for email, browsing, and a lil music, but none at the same time); cable + wifi + cell + landline + walkie-talkie feature but only spend 100 minutes a month talking to people outside…
There’s a lot of things that in our “blessing” that we are really wasteful stewards in.
Wonder when the next “Waste Not Church Conference” will be to talk about this issue too.
Comment by arjwdotcom — April 10, 2008 @ 2:55 am
Jon, the girl in the dress is one of her two beautiful (twin) daughters. She also has a great hubby and a lovely son who would make fab son-in-law material if only I could arrange it!
Comment by Carole — April 10, 2008 @ 11:54 am
skittles are more fun, if you paint faces on them, – who’s nicked the ball?
Comment by su — April 10, 2008 @ 11:00 pm
lori… are you hoping to gain weight or to stop being a glutton?
carole… have you sorted out the dowry?
arjwdotcom… ’stewardship’ is the watchword i think.
bowled over by your comment su.
Comment by jonbirch — April 11, 2008 @ 12:24 am
He’d have me as a mum-in-law, who could ask for anything more?
Comment by Carole — April 11, 2008 @ 1:29 pm
aaaaah.
that was ‘aaaaah’ as in ‘aaaaah, bless.’
Comment by jonbirch — April 11, 2008 @ 1:57 pm